Wednesday, May 23, 2012

Mike Hoggard Part 3 - Are You Being Brainwashed?

In my first article on Mike Hoggard I gave a general overview of some problems I had with him. This article can be read at:

In my second article I focused on his King James Code using numerics. That article can be accessed here.

 Now on to a different subject, but one that is pertinent and important to understand.

There are different types of techniques used in brainwashing. Here are some things that are used for hypnosis that can help when brainwashing someone. 1) Build a rapport with the listener, 2) turn off their critical thinking, 3) make irresistible suggestions, 4) project authority on an issue, 5) help them (not necessarily in a physical way) even if they don't want it, so that they feel they owe you, 6) sympathize with them and stress the importance of them making good decisions (which of course you will help influence), 7) make them feel insecure about themselves as if they lack something (in this case knowledge), 8) make them believe your opinion is the one that matters, 9) shame, scold, or blame them or others, 10) use your power to make them feel threatened in some way, as in “I am right and you are wrong,” 11) use body language to manipulate them,12) find their weak points and exploit them.

When embarking on a course of action to change people's minds, it is important to also focus on an enemy (Hoggard is obsessed with the Masons and the giants and how they plan on changing our DNA), use repetition when speaking about this enemy to drive certain associations into the mind (he talks about them incessantly, repeating things and certain words (like DNA) ad naseum), and use words such as “imagine”, “picture”, “what if” (Hoggard's favorite phrase is “think about this”), to force them to see a scenario you want them to believe. Along with this, to change a world view or way of perceiving things, it is necessary to develop a new vocabulary. By that it does not mean to create new words, but to redefine words with which people are already familiar, so that later these words can be found in a passage, but the meaning can be changed from the normal understanding. (Hoggard does this quite a bit. In my other article I presented the following incidents - he redefined the word “folly” to mean a sexual crime, and he has redefined the phrase “Sons of God” to only mean angels, rather than angels in the O.T. and us as adopted children of God in the N.T., so that now he has us becoming angels upon death thereby changing established theology. He also has changed the doctrine of salvation to be about the giants.)

It is also a good technique to get people into a trance-like state to make them more receptive to these changes, by lulling them into a semi-conscious state. This can be done simply by boring them with rhetoric which rambles incoherently, as in stream of conscious thinking out loud or in use of constant repetition. (This is exactly how Hoggard preaches. He rambles all over for the first hour or so, never getting around to his topic at least until then. By that point I know my brain is screaming. I have to listen to him in small increments or I tune out, as I am sure do others. He also repeats ideas or words or phrases a lot.) In a half-asleep state, the mind is receptive to changes in definitions, new ideas which might conflict, and critical thinking skills will be turned off. In many cases, the things being said will not even be consciously heard, but will by-pass the thinking mind and just go straight into the brain for storage. People won't hear (by that I mean consciously comprehend) the things which would normally make them get alarmed and make them realize that something is wrong. I know this from talking to people about his sermons. They do not even hear the things I hear until they go back and listen for what I have told them he has said. Then they hear it.

While I will not say that Mike Hoggard is deliberately doing this, (I will merely say that Satan is very effectively manipulating him) the fact is, he is doing this. As already mentioned, when I have logged on to a sermon based on the title, I find that within that first hour, often the subject isn't even mentioned. He seems to start at one point, and then aimlessly wanders around under the guise of making connections between things based upon numbers or word associations, but often these things have no end in sight. When concluded one is led to say, “okay, and....what is the point? Where are we going with this?” After a hour of this, one is lulled into a semi-conscious state and not really listening to what he says. It is at this point that he starts in doing things such as redefining words. For an example of this, I refer you to the above incident with the word “folly” where he redefined it as meaning “sex crimes.” He also has spent time talking about the word “thorns” in one of his messages. Let me show you how this redefining of words could be used to change one's entire viewpoint about another person, so that one then might be prone to mistrust that person.

While when preaching on “folly” Mike never mentioned the passage about Paul asking the Corinthians to bear with him in his folly, and for good reason, let's use this as an example. During the course of this sermon, he redefined the word “folly” from meaning “foolishness” to meaning “sexual sins or crimes.” You now associate the word “folly” with sex sins and crimes. I also listened to a sermon he gave about thorns. In the sermon on thorns that I excerpt and use to demonstrate this technique below Hoggard leads you to the idea that thorns mean sin and eventually he leads to thorns having to do with DNA. Now I will give an example below to show you how this redefining works to change your entire viewpoint.  Given his redefinitions we will have “folly” meaning sex crimes, and “thorns” meaning “sin” and associated with DNA. Now look at where something you once understood in a completely different way can now be altered. First we go to the passage where Paul talks about the thorn in the flesh he has, and how he has prayed for God to rid him of it. 2 Corinthians 12:7 “And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.” So now instead of thinking, as most scholars have thought, that he was speaking of his poor eyesight (Galatians 6:11 “Ye see how large a letter I have written unto you with mine own hand.” This would be a thorn in his side as it would be a hard thing given his calling as an apostle and all the studying, reading, and writing he would need to do), we now must reinterpret it via Mike's definitions to mean that Paul has a sin. And not just any sin, but using Mike's definitions, a sin connected with a messenger of Satan (angels), and DNA. (Remember fallen angels corrupting man's DNA is his biggest message). Now you are taken to the passage about Paul wishing people were celibate as he is. 1 Corinthians 7:7-8 “For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that. I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.” So we see that Paul has chosen to remain celibate. Now we are taken to another passage. 2 Corinthians 11:1 “Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.” Now before adopting all these newly defined words, we used to interpret it that Paul preferred to remain celibate so that he could devote himself totally to the Lord and not have to worry about a wife. We also know that he had eyesight problems which has been assumed to be the thorn in the flesh that God would not remove. Lastly we have been told that he is asking the Corinthians to bear with him in his folly, which we used to interpret as meaning any little foolishness on his part, as we are all human and make mistakes. But you have been reprogrammed. What has your brain been set up to now see this as meaning, without anyone saying a word? You now immediately make the connection that Paul's thorn in the flesh is that he is guilty of sexual sins and perversions. That would certainly be influenced by a demonic messenger, and sex and DNA (genetic material via sperm and egg) go hand in hand and that is probably why he has to remain celibate. Maybe there is a problem in his DNA? Now should we trust what Paul says? See how this programming works? This new interpretation is not what the Scriptures teach about Paul. Not at all. But it is the interpretation you now come to thanks to Mike Hoggard's new definitions.

So this basically explains what I wanted to say about Hoggard's technique, but if interested in actually seeing it in action, I have below a synopsis and some transcription of his sermon on thorns for anyone who wants to be thorough in understanding what is going on. It is easy to find this sermon on Youtube by searching for Mike Hoggard and Crown of thorns. Understand that I do not disagree with some things he says, for instance, we all still do sin and need to repent, but notice that he never follows up his chastisement of us with telling us that we should repent and get right with God if we have sinned. He merely tells us how we commit some heinous sins. And Christ did take the curse of sin upon Himself, but there is much more inserted into his sermon than these simple truths. These are the truths around which he builds his other teachings, which are not necessarily truths.

Before beginning, I want to recap techniques of brainwashing. Start by rambling so that people become bored and only half listen so that you can turn off critical thinking (Hoggard is good at this). Build a rapport (he is very folksy and makes you feel like you are one of his buddies). Project an air of authority. (Hoggard is the one receiving the direct revelations from God, unlike you). Focus on an enemy (we see the giants coming into practically every sermon, as well as the Masons). Make irresistible suggestions, (he is always making hints toward an idea without stating them, and asking you to jump to the conclusion that he says are fascinating or interesting and if you can figure out what he is suggesting, then you are one of the “in” crowd), make them feel you are helping them (to see the truth that they are otherwise too dumb to understand), sympathize with their need to want to make good decisions about what to believe (so that they don't become apostate like everyone else), make them feel insecure about their own opinions or beliefs, (as if they lack the proper insight due to lack of special revelation), make them feel that yours (the person doing the brainwashing) is the only opinion that matters (Mike is the recipient of all this special knowledge from God, so his opinion is better than yours), shame or scold them so that they feel they should believe you and use your position/power to make them feel threatened, exploit their weak points (he will often point out how sinful you are), use body language (he is always holding up the books and using facial expressions), repeat things over and over to drill them into the mind (Hoggard is good at repeating things) , use words such as “picture”, “visualize”, “draw”, “imagine”, “think”, (Hoggard's favorite phrase is “think about this”) and redefine a vocabulary (which I have shown how he does this). Let's see how many of these things we find in the sermon below.

Direct quotes are in italics. Note things in bold print.

At the beginning of the sermon Hoggard starts talking about examples and symbols and the thorns on Jesus head at the crucifixion. He goes on for about twenty-five minutes before getting to where I pick it up here. He starts by telling us how thorns do two things - they pain and sting. “Thorns were designed by God to do one thing, and that is pierce and sting. So it requires a little bit of thought on our part (he's going to help you understand what you didn't know before) in looking at thorns. Everybody knows thorns, we all know what a thorn is. Thorns are all over the world. (the word “thorn” is repeated a lot). And so God is drawing this picture (use of the word “draw”) for us of something that we are able to recognize and we think about what a thorn represents. And what does it mean, why was it put upon His head? (Now you are going to get your definition). Why was it there? And so for our answers to understanding the crown of thorns, let us go to the Scriptures. (According to Hoggard all his definitions come from the Scriptures, but as shown, he manipulates the Scriptures to come up with his definitions and often uses occult Masonic books for some of his ideas). Let's go to actually the first place in the Bible that uses the word thorn, where thorns appear. We go back to Genesis chapter 3. As it was back then, so shall it be is what the Bible says.” (It doesn't exactly say it that way.) Then he goes to Gen.3 and says to think about what happens. (Again notice his favorite catch phrase that he repeats). “Number 1, we have the temptation of Eve and we have the sin of Eve and Adam. We have all kinds of symbols here, (most of Hoggards teachings are built on symbology, not the straightforward face value of a verse) the fruit. Your eyes being open. (Notice that he is implanting the thought that it is your eyes being open, not Eve's. He's telling you that your eyes are about to be opened by what he says.) The fact that Eve was looking at the tree and all three things that compel us to sin showed up. The lust of the flesh. The lust of the eyes and the pride of life. I want you to think of these three things as we study this idea of thorns, (repetition of think with guided thinking) because we're going to see it a little bit later. We're going to see it in the Scriptures, we're going to see it out of the Scriptures. (He is telling you that his ideas are also coming from a source besides the Bible on this – as a spoiler, he means the Masonic “bibles” by Manly Hall or Albert Pike) So number one, the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. (repetition) And those things that the devil used to tempt Eve when she ate of the fruit and she gave it to her husband. Those things had consequences. And I want you to think about this. (again telling you to think) Sin always has consequences to it. There are always reactions to our actions. God had actually warned, He had actually warned Adam what would happen in the day that he ate of the fruit. He said, ye shall surely die. And God's word was absolute, it cannot be broken. The devil also told Eve something else that we'll look at later on.” He then goes to Gen. 3:17-18 and reads it. “And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field.” He points out and says “now we are getting an understanding. (you are receiving hidden revelation via Mike, which makes him an authority and his opinion counts and makes you special for receiving it and here it comes). That “the thorns symbolize a curse.” (Notice how symbolism again enters in. And thorns are not symbolic of the curse, they are the result of the curse.) That now Adam will have to work and labor and eat bread in sorrow and he will be tired and hate his job, because of man's sinfulness. (By the way, this is not hidden revelation. This is merely what the Scriptures say, so revelation is not needed). That instead of good stuff coming up, thorns will be coming up. He says that they aren't attractive or good for anything and they hurt when we touch them. Then he says that we should think about things that sting in the Bible....(note how he has told you you will be receiving understanding, then starts guiding you toward the thought and associations he wants you to have) The Bible is going to say this is as that in relation to things that sting (he is telling you that he is going to be making associations, but notice that he says that it is the Bible making these associations, not him).....Disobedience to God seems to be the theme that surrounds this idea of thorns. That God tells us that when we are obedient things are good.” So now we are to associate thorns with stinging and disobedience. He says disobedience is the theme, but he adds far more than that to his meaning of thorns.

He then makes the comparison that just as God took Israel out of Egypt, He takes us out of our sins when we accept Him, and just as Israel promised to follow Him into the promised land God will lead us into the “promised land”. But just as Israel didn't clean out the land of giants when they went in (Here we go again with the giants. Everything always comes back to the giants, doesn't it? This is the enemy on which he focuses), we make all kinds of promises to God how we will be good, but we aren't. (Now comes the shame and scolding). He says that nobody after they get saved leads a perfect unblemished life. Then he quotes Numbers 33:55 “But if ye will not drive out the inhabitants of the land from before you; then it shall come to pass, that those which ye let remain of them shall be pricks in your eyes, and thorns in your sides, and shall vex you in the land wherein ye dwell.” (So now we have been guided to also have a direct association between thorns and giants).

Now we are told that there will be thorns in your side as a result of you not getting rid of the things you promised God you would get rid of but didn't. (Here we see the shame and scolding again). He says that we defile ourselves and it is a thorn in our flesh. (Note that thorns are now associated with the word defile). It has consequences.Disobedience to God equals thorns. Thorns in your side. They hurt and fester. But this is what God said would happen. If we're not careful the thorns will thrive and take over.” He quotes Joshua 23:13 “Know for a certainty that the LORD your God will no more drive out any of these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you.” (Again associating thorns with giants). He says to look at the exact language of the KJV Bible. He repeats several times to “think about it.” He now mentions how the people left in Canaan that were not gotten rid of due to disobedience became thorns in their side the rest of their lives and so do our sins. So now he has made the connection between our sin and giants several times by making thorns the connecting thought. (As he believes that the return of the nephilim/giants to infect our DNA with their DNA is the mark of the beast, you can see how he is leading you to see how his teaching of the connection between sin (accepting the mark) and the mark of the beast being DNA of the angels/nephilim/giants is validated.)

Hoggard then says that he has met Belial, who is the devil, several times. (Hoggard actually states that he has met the devil, Belial himself. Several times in fact. In person? How many people do you know who personally have encountered Satan several times?) He then quotes 2 Sam 23:6 “But the sons of Belial shall be all of them as thorns thrust away, because they cannot be taken with hands.” He says that the important word here is “as.” Of all the words in the sentence, the word “as” is the most important? He talks about the phrase sons of Belial or children of Belial saying that there is no fellowship between Christ and the devil. This is what he gets from the word “as”? (If he were to read the entire passage, he would find that this verse is saying that the wicked must be dealt with as one deals with thorns. One cannot gently take them by the hand and uproot them. One must use gloves and deal with them by chopping them down, as that is the only way to get rid of them.) Then he moves on from that and says that Gen. 3 teaches us that Satan has a seed. (Now again we see him leading you to the connection and thought that thorns are speaking of the actual seed of Satan, which includes the giants). That he has offspring. The sons of Belial are his offspring. They hate God and God's people. It says the sons of Belial will be “as” thorns. We have people all around us that are wicked, that are thorns. They will have an influence and do things in the church. “There is one particular identity in the Scriptures that thorns represent. There are two bloodlines in Genesis. The seed of woman comes to fruition in Jesus Christ. Who then would be the fruition or fulfillment of the seed of Belial? He then tells us to think about it. (An irresistible suggestion. It's a mystery you can solve.)

Hoggard then goes to 2 Chronicles 33 where it talks about Manasseh being taken among the thorns and carried to Babylon. (This only has relevance because of the following.) He mentions that Manasseh reigned 55 years and that the words “Satan” and “devils” are mentioned 55 times in the Bible. So you are to draw a connection between wicked Manasseh and Satan due to the number 55.  Why is that necessary?  I would think the wickedness would give it away. (Actually Satan is named 56 times and the word devil 60 times. Note his used of his Bible code to show you how right his opinion is in what he is saying in creating this numerological connection. That his authority of this knowledge supersedes your simple understanding.) He then makes mention of the importance of the number 5 and asks you to remember a pentagram. (All this about Manasseh has been to have a reason to talk about the number 5. Now he is leading you to make connections he wants you to make.) Getting back to the thorns, he says they represent the wickedness of the world. He then talks about God warning Adam about the curse and then he throws in this idea of thorns coming up and thorns sting. (Now we see he repeats the idea of stinging and he will start reinforcing that association through the image of bees). Then goes to Psalm 118:10-12 “All nations compassed me about: but in the name of the LORD will I destroy them. They compassed me about; yea, they compassed me about: but in the name of the LORD I will destroy them. They compassed me about like bees; they are quenched as the fire of thorns: for in the name of the LORD I will destroy them.” This does not say that the bees are stinging, but are swarming.  And these thorns are on fire and being quenched, not stinging, so this verse really does not work on his behalf.

Now he gives you a picture image by talking about how people who used to sit next to him in church hate God now, and old time preachers have strayed from God and then he reads the Scripture above in Psalms. He stops at the words “bees” and “thorns” emphasizing them and asks what they have in common. He again tells you to “think. He shows how big a bee and thorn are and then references how big we are in comparison. He points out that they are small but have a sting. Then he points out another similarity between bees and thorns, and he shows a graphic. (So now he is bringing you to where he wants you to make the association of bees/sting, and thorns/sting – to the enemy). He goes to a Masonic apron which has bees on it and he says what looks like laurel is really a sprig of acacia which is really a thorn tree, so the Masonic emblem has bees and thorns. They both point toward something (which he isn't going to tell you right now, as he wants to keep it suspenseful) because they both sting. He stresses this is very important. You don't know where this is leading, but he will get you there.

He then teaches that Freemasonry teaches that if you will follow Masonry you will be rejuvinated or revived or be resurrected in some way. He says that a person or church starts out wanting to serve the Lord, that we are the vineyard of the Lord, then he says that while he doesn't believe in works for salvation, one must labor for the Lord to keep the thorns down. (This is true. He does also teach truths within his sermons, and I do acknowledge that, but Satan always has much truth in what he says too. It's the lies you have to watch.) He gives you a word picture (again drawing pictures for you) about gardening, and laboring to keep the weeds out. Then he talks about sloth and laziness. (Take note of the sins he accuses his listeners of during the course of this sermon.)  He reads Proverbs 24:30-31 which talks about nettles and thorns. He asks if you are “getting it”. (Notice the slight put down that maybe you aren't smart enough to get it without his help). That the thorns choked the vineyard because nobody does anything. That when you don't tend the vineyard, the thorns come in. Now he says that he's about to show us something that will makes us say, “Mike Hoggard, you're crazy. (Note now he tells us that the revelation he is about to give us is going to set off alarms and bells in our minds. He wants us to turn those bells and alarms off.) He then says that he just wants us to look at the Scriptures. (He is trying to make you see that he is only using the Scriptures to show you all this, but what he doesn't say is that he often changes the meaning of those Scriptures.) Proverbs 26:9 “ As a thorn goeth up into the hand of a drunkard, so is a parable in the mouth of fools.” (He now makes another association he wants you to make) He says that thorns are associated with drunkenness. (Notice that is not what this verse is teaching. It says as a drunkard cannot handle a thorn without hurting himself and possibly others, neither does a fool know how to properly employ a parable, but can use it to hurt others or himself. The thorns and drunkenness are not equated here at all. The point is a drunkard would not be capable of handling it carefully.) He then refers to Nahum 1:10-11 which he says is saying the same thing. “For while they be folden together as thorns, and while they are drunken as drunkards, they shall be devoured as stubble fully dry. There is one come out of thee, that imagineth evil against the LORD, a wicked counseller.” Actually this verse says that while the Assyrians were as untouchable as thorns folded together (when they were sober and ready), that they would be taken while drunken and unprepared. (Again it does not equate thorns with drunkenness. He is leading you to think this.) Hoggard says now we have from these verses the following associations. We have thorns, we have drunkenness, we have a wicked counsellor. He tells us we know that the wicked counsellor is the antichrist. (So now we have moved from thorns and bees stinging to associating thorns with drunkenness and antichrist. He then throws in the information that there was a movie made about the antichrist called the Omen, which he apparently has seen, and most people are familiar with it even if they haven't seen it. It is a great picture to insert in your brain.  In fact he seems to have been obsessed with aliens, demons, and the like in his youth and spent much time reading or watching shows/movies about such.  Note how he is leading you down this path and giving you associations and pictures to keep in your mind.)

Now we are taken to Isaiah 34:14 “The wild beasts of the desert shall also meet with the wild beasts of the island, and the satyr shall cry to his fellow; the screech owl also shall rest there, and find for herself a place of rest.” He talks about the symbolism of dragons being spirits. (I don't see the word "dragons" in this verse, do you?)  They live in the wilderness, in untended, unkempt ground. (Now where did this come from? How is this verse relevant to anything he has said so far? Notice how he will now draw a picture and association for you, and because there is no Scripture to tie them together, so he will create the connection.) He says that because of the disobedience of the people, God will “choke them out of the land by thorns and nettles and owls and dragons will move in.” (He is combining apples and oranges to get peaches.) Now he states that in an absence of willingness to obey God, the thorns take over and now your mind will add dragons and owls to that.

He now takes us to Jeremiah 4:3 “For thus saith the LORD to the men of Judah and Jerusalem, Break up your fallow ground, and sow not among thorns.” He says that when you plant your garden you have to break up the ground first. Seed thrown on stony ground won't produce fruit, it dies. The Bible talks about beating swords into plowshares. He says that he takes the Bible which is a sword and turns it into a plowshare and stands in the pulpit and we let our hearts get hard and it has to be plowed up as it is hard against the Word of God. (He is all over the place with metaphors by now, and the chastisement comes again with him making you feel insecure and grateful to him for his saving you from yourself. He is in a place of power in your life. He is the one preventing these thorns from popping up by showing you all this "truth".) “Every now and then as a preacher. Every now and then as a preacher I'll stand behind our pulpit, and I'll take this sword and I'll beat it into a plowshare and while I'm preaching my intention is to plow up the stony ground of people's hearts. Stony ground inhibits God in our life.” He then goes on to explain that we get adamant about stuff and that we don't want to accept what the Bible says,(he also means that people might not want to accept what he says, which means they are an enemy, as he is one of God's watchers according to his own testimony) and we need to have our stony hearts plowed up so that we can accept what God's Word says (according to his interpretation.)

Then he says that we are to “sow not among thorns.” Then he asks us "Why did God say that." Obviously we are not smart enough to understand the concept, so now he takes us back to the book of Mark and Jesus' teachings. He says that Jesus interprets his parables and defines the words. (Just as he does). Mark 4:18-19 “These are they which are sown among thorns.” He talks about how we have thorns in us because we lust, after money, other men's wives, etc. (Again he paints us with the worst of sins, greed and adultery). He says, “Money is the biggest liar in the universe.” He warns people to be careful as they need to cut down the thorns in their life. (I thought Satan was the biggest liar, but he is equating money with Satan and the worst thorn and then immediately follows it up with telling you that you need to cut this thorn out of your life. Possibly getting rid of some of that money by throwing it his way? Now we get to the numbers game.) “We see the number three associated with thorns. (Where exactly did we see that? That's not on his numbers list. Check out the King James Code article) Heb. 6:7 'For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: (remember this phrase in bold print later on, for he will use another verse about the rain which will be again pertinent to his teaching you the supposed truth. Your subconscious mind will recall that this was associated with him saying that he was plowing up the ground of your stony heart, even though he won't refer back to this.)  But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.' This is what happens to people who let the thorns take over. There is blessing and cursing in this verse. The fruits are the evidence of our relationship with God, but those who let the thorns grow are rejected and are cast into the lake of fire.” (See how the number three now means sin instead of divine completeness? And where exactly did the number three come in?)

He continues, “Now we're going to bring something else in with this. We saw things that sting. We saw the bees and we saw thorns. Notice in Ezekiel Chapter 2 how God associates it again, (2:6) “And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house.” (Now Hoggard is going to create yet another association to move this thought further along the path he wants you to take. Look how he now creates a connection to make thorns mean “words” and "scorpions". While the verse indicates that in life people are going to be thorns in our side and their words may hurt, it does not mean that every time you see the word “thorns” you should immediately associate it with “words.”) Notice this that God is having Ezekiel preach to a people who are going to use words against him. What did the Bible say that the serpent used against Eve? (Now he has created a connection that let's him lead you back to the incident that will let him bring in his numerology and thereby back to his favorite subject, DNA. Notice that this journey from starting with thorns has meandered around for the express purpose of bringing you to his favorite subject, that of DNA and the giants.) 

There are some people who have this idea that the serpent, the devil, mated with Eve. The Bible doesn't say that anywhere. You know what the Bible says Satan did? He used words on her and God is saying that in Ezekiel chapter two that these words are like thorns and briars, and he's dwelling among scorpions. (Now we stop to draw attention to scorpions by having you think on the word “sting”. This will lead again to fallen angels via Revelation which again brings us back to the incident of the angels mating with women and creating giants.) Stop and think about it. (Again he is using his catch phrase to tell you that you need to force your brain to see the “logic” he is laying out for you.) We have bees, we have thorns, briars. We have nettles and they all sting. (Note the repetition of the mention of these things.) The Bible uses the phrase cockles and when I was a kid running through the woods we used to get cockle burrs stuck on our pants they have little stingers on them that grab ahold of things. We have scorpions. (Notice he gives you an imagery to visualize.) Things that sting. (Again note the repetition of the word “sting” over and over.) And in some cases like with bees and scorpions when they sting they inject poison. By the way, how does a serpent get his poison into you? With these little fangs in his mouth that, that pierce and they sting. (Notice the constant use of imagery.) You see how the Bible is relating all of these things together, (actually it is Mike that is relating some of these things together by not looking at the verses in context. He is drawing parallels to lead to a point of his own making, not necessarily of God's making.) bees and thorns and scorpions and nettles and serpents.(Note that none of these verses mentioned serpents, did they? Mike has pulled that into the mix himself.) Things that sting or things that pierce. Think about the Scriptures. Think about the symbolism in the Scriptures. (His entire teaching in this sermon has to do not with what the Scriptures say directly, but about all the symbolism he finds within them. So what do the Scriptures in context actually teach? You are never told.) And now let's look at things. These scorpions, these thorns, these things that sting

Revelation chapter 9 Verse 1 the Bible says 'And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as - there's that word “as” - the scorpions of the earth have power. And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them. And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men. And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions. And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle. And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months. And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.' 

And I want you to notice in Revelation 9 verse 10 'and they had tails and their stings were in their tails' (He misquotes this.) Now let me stop right here because I want you to be thinking about something in the Bible that has a sting to it and what that sting is. (Again he is telling you to think. How many times has he done that in this sermon? He is telling you to implant the idea that he is about to give you into your brain. Now if you have fallen into that semi-conscious attitude mentioned before, what happens every time he tells you to think? You obey the command and insert the information he is giving you as factual without using your critical thinking skills.) What all these thorns and bees and everything, what they ultimately represent. (Now we come to the point he is really getting to, for you are told this is the ultimate meaning he wants you to connect to the word thorns.) And by the way, these scorpions, these sting things, they have a king. A king wears a crown. Are you getting where we're going here? (Are you spiritual enough to understand this hidden meaning? Are you special?) Revelation 9:11, I think there's something (in this verse) about September 11th and I'm going to show a little bit of it. 9-11. (Catch the use of numerology?) Revelation 9:11. (Seriously? We are going to try to make a connection between 9-11 and the king of the bottomless pit through numerology? He's kidding, right?) And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon. He is the king of all stings. Okay, he's the sting king. (A little memory devise with a little humor here?) I guess you could say it. There was a movie called the Scorpion King. It was about him. (I don't think that is exactly accurate. The movie was not based on the Bible.) The sting represents 1 Corinthians 15. It represents death. The sting of death is sin.”

He repeats again that bees, thorns, the serpent all sting. He tells you again to think about the king (the king of the scorpions).Think of what the devil said to her that was in contradiction to what God said. In other words the sting is coming. He got Eve to eat by lying. He added one word to what God said and completely changed the meaning. This number 5 is always associated with death. (Where does the Bible teach that?) The 5 books of the law are the law of sin and death. (That does not make the number 5 mean death.) The pentagram is the symbol of Lucifer. It has five points that “look exactly like thornsWhen he looks at a pentagram he sees a crown of thorns. (Again with the picture imagery so that you will see this picture in your mind every time you hear the word “thorns”.) Now he says that he has counted the number of words that Satan said to Eve. It is “Exactly 46 words which is the number of chromosomes in our cells. Where our DNA is stored. Our DNA always brings about death. It is built into our DNA. The thorns are built into us by way of our chromosomes, our own DNA.” (Now I cannot read Hebrew, but by going to an interlinear Hebrew/English Bible, it would appear that Satan said 28 or so words to Eve, as he did not speak in English. Even if it were a few more, which it does not appear to be, it comes nowhere near the 46 Hoggard says it is. But as he is desperately trying to get you to the subject of DNA, he has now taken you through this long round-about journey through the word “thorn” and ended up here in Genesis, telling you that the 46 (English translated) words that Satan spoke to Eve has everything to do with DNA because of the number 46. Can it be seen that this is sheer manipulation?)

Now he continues, “Matthew 7:16-20 Ye shall know them by their fruits..Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” Notice how he's pointing out an association between corrupt trees and thorns and thistles. (Yet another association he wants you to have with thorns.) Now I mentioned the 46 words that Lucifer spoke to Eve in the garden associated with our chromosomes our DNA. (Again there is no association at all between the number of words Satan spoke to Eve and DNA. That is a ridiculous statement.) And I mentioned when we read this earlier, I mentioned about the very word of the Scriptures. How they were used to describe what the soldiers did with Jesus. (I don't remember what he said about that, but of course the words in the Bible described what the soldiers did to Jesus.  What else would they do?  I must have missed some mystical connection that he made.) Now, number 1, we have a crown, okay, we have a king, something that reigns over mankind. We have thorns we see the symbolism there (He is reminding you of all the connections he has made to the word “thorns”), but notice in John chapter 19 verse 2 “and the soldiers platted a crown of thorns.(Okay, now I see what he was referring to when he was talking about the "word of Scriptures" being used to describe what the soldiers did to Jesus. He's focusing on the word "platted." He is going to pull all these ideas he has been laying down together for you.) I've been studying the Bible and I grew up in church (He is telling you his credentials so that you respect his authority on this matter) and I've read that thing I don't know how many times and I decided to just go look up what the word plat means, when they platted a crown, and you know what the word plat means? (Apparently he thinks you wouldn't since he didn't.) They braided it. Wove it together. (I think most people probably already knew that plat meant to braid or twist together. To make a crown out of thorns it would require that they twist it together so that it would stay in the circular shape. It was not done for the purpose he is about to state. This is coming straight out of his own imagination, not the Bible.) It was a symbol of DNA. (Seriously? Are you going to believe this? The soldiers twisted it together so that it would resemble DNA?  They didn't even know about DNA.) The coiling, the coiling (note the repetition of the word “coiling” for emphasis) DNA. The ribbon-like (again, painting a picture) DNA. The strands woven together, platted together, braided together, (again, repetition and emphasis to implant the thought) is what they did. (Now we get to his favorite topic, DNA and Masons.)  

It's our own, it's our own DNA that's ruling over us in our flesh that's killing us and it needs to be crucified, it needs to be killed. Let me thrown this in here very quickly. (Now he throws in something he wants to implant in your mind that is not really on topic, but he wants that connection made in your mind.) We're talking about Freemasonry and their symbols, (we were?) and they use this sprig of acacia and I'll show you how in a little bit. They use this sprig of acacia and there's a Masonic emblem where you have a woman. Now a woman in symbolism always represents mystery Babylon the great (That is a very broad statement. Certain women in religious contexts symbolically do, but not every woman.) and she is a mother. And in this particular case this mother is holding a sprig of acacia or thorns in her hand and she is weeping over what Masons call the broken column. (Not to be picky, but in this particular picture, the woman is Virgo the Virgin and is not a mother.) Now the broken column in all the Masonic literature represents the god-like Osiris, or Bacchus or Apollo or any of these other gods who died and was broken up and they're waiting his resurrection but here's the interesting thing associated with these thorns, that you have Saturn. Father time they call him with wings, Saturn is another name for Satan, and you know what he's doing with her hair? He's braiding her hair to make ringlets, to make like DNA. (Are you following this, or is this rambling losing you? Now ringlets represent DNA? Really?)  

Think about a column that was broken. 9-11. September 11, 2001. 9-11 (Again he's bringing this sermon which was supposed to be about the crown of thorns on Jesus head to be about 9-11? And when someone drew that picture ages ago they had DNA and 9-11 in mind?) Remember the king of the bottomless pit. There are like three or four different versions of this (drawing of Statue of Liberty with twin towers burning in background) that I saw after 9-11 and I caught on to the symbolism of it. (At this point I feel compelled to stop and say that he isn't wrong about the Statue of Liberty representing Babylon or whatever goddess you want to call her, and that there was a reason behind the destruction of the twin towers as a sacrifice to Satan, but he is approaching all this in such a round about way with no real organization or sense, and inserting things that are manipulated and incorrect that one almost is required to dismiss it all.) Remember we have mystery Babylon who was mourning over the broken column with acacia in her hand and here we have these graphics of the Statue of Liberty, the goddess with thorns coming...she has a crown of thorns, seven of them, (I thought 5 was the pertinent number) and she is weeping over the broken columns of 9-11. Hmm. (I don't deny that the occult and Masons use symbols, and use them to refer to acts they are committing now. This is true.  However, he is again bringing in all this information in the most abstract way, so that people do not understand how this all applies and where it comes from.  Plus he is adding in things that are not correct, which then taints the true information.)

Here's what I was going to talk about last week that I, .... The Lord said wait and I'll show it to you. (So now the Lord (?) is telling him that he should not share things and that Mike has to wait on further revelations that nobody else has every known about 9-11? Okay. Do you want to believe that?) I was dealing with these things, the issues that come out of the heart of mankind and there was a....I've seen a lot of Catholic paintings of Jesus and they always depict Jesus in various ways usually with very subtle occult symbolism behind it and I want you to notice this particular Jesus. (He shows a picture of Jesus with his hand raised and pointing three fingers.) Number one he has his three fingers raised here. Remember what thorns represent, the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life (when exactly did thorns start representing those three things, even though he has mentioned this before?), but it's also as above, so below. (Now wait, does he mean that thorns represent as above, so below? I'm confused.) We talked about that in several videos. Things of heaven fusing together with things of the earth. As it was, as it was in the days of Noah, the floods came up from the ground and the floods came down from the skies and that is a picture of what is going to happen. Angels are going to fall from heaven, and beasts are gonna rise up from the earth and it's the flood of ungodliness is going to sweep over planet in days that could be coming very very soon. (And as I predicted, here we are at the account in Genesis of the angels coming down and mating with mankind. This is his obsession.) And we see that image of Baphomet (shows a picture of Baphomet) whose holding, he's got two fingers here, three fingers here, twenty-three and then he's making the opposite symbol here, twenty-three. (He's showing that Baphomet has two fingers pointing up in his right hand, and three fingers pointing down in his left hand.) That's forty-six, that's our chromosomes, where the DNA is stored. (So Hoggard has discovered this mystery that has eluded everyone that Baphomet is symbolizing our chromosomes with his hand signals? And this came as a revelation from God obviously, because it most assuredly did not come from the Bible, where he should be getting his information.) That's where the sting of death is built into us right now." 

Hoggard then points out that the picture he had of what he calls a Catholic Jesus as the Catholic church uses this picture, is pointing to his heart which has flames coming out of it and thorns surrounding it. “Now remember, Jesus described thorns as being the deceitfulness of riches.” (Now we're back to thorns being about money.) He then references a previous video where he talked about things that deceive. Then he asks if we know what is the biggest deceiver in the world. He tells us it is “the heart of man.  Jeremiah 17:9 'The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?' Here's what Jesus said about the heart of man - Mark 7:21-23 'For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.' they're in our hearts.(Remember that I said to keep track of the sins he accuses his followers of. Never does he talk about repentance. Just accusations.)  And by the way there are 13 things here. The York Rite of Freemasonry and we pointed this out. The York Rite of Freemasonry has 13 steps.” He says how when you ascend up the ladder of 13 steps it teaches that you will become as a god, like what Satan told Eve. “Here we have 13 things that are already in our heart. And you can't say I don't have none of these, bless God, you've got em.” (Now he draws your notice that you have “13” sins that defile you within you. You are tied to the ladder in Freemasonry, and it's all about DNA.) “I want you to notice the symbolism in Revelation chapter 13. The number 13 is associated with the beast. (Now your sins are connected to the beast, for you have 13 of them, and 13 is his number according to Hoggard.) Revelation 13:1 “And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea,” Now I want you to think about this. (Are you catching it when he's saying “think” now? Are your critical thinking skills working?) He's in the heart of the earth. That's where Jesus said he was going and He went to preach to spirits that were in prison so the beast is in the heart of the earth and here's this graphic of Jesus pointing to a heart with thorns in it. Guess what this is all about? John said he saw the beast rising up out of the sea and even our own hearts are surrounded by an ocean. (Now this is laying the foundation for another doctrine that does not agree with a literal reading of the Bible. He is laying the foundation for the idea that the temple that antichrist will sit in is not a real temple in Jerusalem, but in the heart of man. Why this is not possible will be discussed later.) It's called the pericardium and its the sac around our heart. It's filled with salt water by the way. (So now you are supposed to associate your heart with the sea.) 

When they pierced Jesus in the side, that sword pierced his pericardium and his heart and the Bible says blood and water issued forth. We're designed in such a beautiful way, the symbolism is here (again, Hoggard is big on symbolism, but not on what God literally says.) and I'm telling you this beast nature can come out of us. (Notice how he is really working to point out how bad you are and how he is trying to help you, so you should be grateful to him.) These thorns can come out and choke out every good thing that we want in life that comes from God if we're not really, really, really careful.  

Let's get into the teachings of Freemasonry very quickly (Why are we learning all this stuff about Freemasonry? How about teaching the Bible?) concerning the acacia, concerning the thorns. Here's what Manly Hall said in the Secret Teachings of All Ages. (Who cares what he says. What does God say?) He says the body of Hiram was buried by the murderers over the brow of Mount Moriah and a sprig of acacia placed upon the grave. Now let me very explain quickly who Hiram Abiff is. Hiram Abiff in all - now he's mentioned in the Bible (Hiram Abiff is not mentioned in the Bible. Hiram, King of Tyre is.) - but the Masonic Hiram is all of the gods throughout mythology that were murdered and are awaiting resurrection (What? He's all the gods of mythology?  He was a real king of Tyre.) and we're going to talk about those in a minute, but here in the Masonic lodge, they, you go through the first three degrees, you with me here? (He checking to make sure you are still accepting what he says.) You go through the three degrees of the blue lodge and during this process a play is acted out for you and actually you're a participant in the play. You actually become Hiram Abiff. Hiram Abiff is the guy who knew the secret.(And what secret might that be? The same one Mike Hoggard has discovered?) He had the mysteries (what mysteries are we talking about here?) and he wouldn't tell anybody. He was the builder of the temple, the body, (Hiram the king helped Solomon build the actual building, according to the Bible, he has nothing to do with our bodies.  The Bible does not teach any of this Masonic stuff that Hoggard is teaching as seemingly truth.) you think about that for a minute, (See how he is now making you start thinking that the word temple only refers to your body, and not a real temple?) and Hiram was murdered by three ruffians, by three men. The interesting thing is when you go into a Masonic Lodge and you see the reenactment of the murder of Hiram Abiff, by the way, if you're the initiate, you're Hiram. And they bring you down and the three ruffians, they smite you and the third time they hit you they hit you on the head and you receive a deadly wound in your head. That's what John saw in Revelation 13 concerning the beast. (John saw the Masonic ritual?) See we're learning things aren't we. (Oh, boy, did you catch that? You are learning mysteries you never knew before. But whose mysteries?) And you receive a wound on your head and in, I'm not making this up, in the Masonic Lodge, you fall backward. And you're murdered. You are the slain god. 

Remember we said earlier about thorns.(Now you are to recall all those words he associated for you. He shows picture of Benny Hinn.) Proverbs talked about thorns and drunkards, thorns and drunkards, they go hand in hand here. (Remember how I discussed that verse? The are not equated in the Bible.) When Hiram is murdered they place thorns over his body. You see a Masonic symbol of a casket with acacia on it. That's thorns that's telling you what this is all about. And remember this, it's equal to drunkenness. (No it is not.) And here we have a practice (Of what practice does he refer? Having an alcoholic beverage?) and I'm not trying to be anybody's enemy, (Ah, we finally got to the threat.), I'm not trying to say you're not saved, (worse threat) or you're going to hell, (major threat). I'm not saying that. (Really? It sounds like your implying it.) I'm just saying that if we're going to be Christians let's act the way the Bible tells us to act (according to Hoggard's beliefs and standards) and get our learning and our knowledge from the Scriptures (or rather from Hoggard's revelations, because while he says that is where this is coming from, he does not go by the Scriptures but rather by his revelations) rather than from what we saw on television or what we went to church and they were doing at church (Now he is jumping from talking about drunkenness to the practice of slain in the spirit.). There is a difference. There's a practice called slain in the spirit. You'll not find it in the Scriptures. None of the apostles practiced it. None of the early church did it. Jesus didn't do it. Nobody, nobody in the Bible ever did this thing. In fact it didn't show up until probably about a hundred or so years ago. Slain in the spirit. (Now this is out of left field and has no connection to what is being discussed, but he takes a break from talking about his topic to touch on a truth so that you are brought back to trusting him, as when he gets away from sound teaching into occult stuff, he needs to keep your critical thinking skills from kicking in to question what he is saying. Most all of his followers do not approve of the Benny Hinns of this world, so now he has his followers back on board with him.) You know how its done don't ya? They walk up, hit you on the head. You fall backward as dead. This whole idea of slain in the spirit, slain means murdered. In what? In your spirit. Spiritually dead. Slain in the spirit. And they say well it's like an act of resurrection. That is what baptism is supposed to represent. But not someone hitting you on the forehead and knocking you, and you literally becoming drunk in the spirit. It is an unbiblical practice. It is a result, watch this, it is a result of people who disregarded the scriptures. Didn't let the doctrine come down as the rain and water their lives. (Now you are supposed to realize that Hoggard's teachings are the rain which will water your life. Remember how I said this phrase about the rain would come up again? Before it was in conjunction with plowing up your stony heart. ) And the thorns came in and started choking the Word out. This is a replacement for true Biblical salvation. And true spiritual indwelling. That's what it is. (Now that he has you back on board, he goes back to the occult teachings he is teaching you, because this is the truth, unlike those replacements for true Biblical teachings. Yeah, right.)  

Manly Hall goes on to say concerning the acacia and concerning the thorns and Hiram who is Osiris, Nimrod, Bacchus, Tammuz, the Bible talks about him. (Him? Him who? Osiris? The Bible doesn't talk about him. Bacchus? The Bible doesn't talk about him either. As for Hiram Abiff, there is no mention of a Hiram Abiff in the Bible. The only Hiram mentioned was the king of Tyre, and while he helped Solomon build the temple, it is doubtful that he did any more actual building than Solomon did, so the Masonic story is probably just that. A story. The Bible does not talk about his murder. As for Tammuz, there is only one mention of him where it talks about the women at the temple crying for him. What exactly is Hoggard trying to say here? That the Bible verifies this Masonic story? It doesn't.) The chest containing the body of Osiris was washed ashore near Biblos and lodged in the roots of a Tamarisk or Acacia which growing into a mighty tree enclosed within its trunk the body of the murdered god. Now remember what we read earlier. That a good tree cannot produce evil fruit or thorns and an evil tree cannot produce good fruit.(So now he is combining the Bible with mythology to teach his “truths?”) You never see apples on a thorn tree. Never You never see oranges or grapes on a thorn tree. And so this idea that the murdered god that represents a tree goes right back to the garden of Eden (Whoa, wait a minute. He's tying in the story of Osiris to the garden of Eden?) because there were two trees. One had good fruit. One had bad fruit. One gave life, the other one had the sting of death in it and that's the one that Eve chose. (So he is tying in Egyptian mythology to the story in Genesis.) 

He goes on to say according to Manly Hall in the Secret Teachings of All Ages, that modern Masons should realize the special Masonic significance of the Phoenix, for the bird is described as using sprigs of acacia in the manufacture of its nest. "We've talked about this Phoenix bird before. The Phoenix is, and here we get into Bible symbolism. (Wait just a minute. The Phoenix is a mythological bird that is never mentioned in the Bible. How could it possibly be Bible symbolism?) Remember, remember when the seed is thrown out there what happens. The birds, the fowls of the air with their wings fly down and they gobble it up so it doesn't ever take root. And the Bible describes those fowled creatures with wings as the devil and his devils. Think about it. (Yes, think about this. Get your critical thinking skills going here.) So here we have a mythological bird. A fowl. A spirit. Okay? And it's called the Phoenix. And the Phoenix builds a nest. It lives in thorns. And the Phoenix is going to die, is dead and is going to be resurrected every 500 years the myth goes. (Now an abrupt change to talk about the Bible.) Incidentally it's the fifth angel that sounds and releases the king of the bottomless pit, who is the Phoenix (Wait, what? The king of the bottomless pit is a mythological bird that is resurrected every 500 years? Where did that come from?) and these scorpions come out and sting men for 5 months. That's why you have the 500 year cycle in the myth. It all goes back to the Scriptures. (Wait. What? What on earth is he talking about? Where is he getting this in Scripture? There's no myth about a Phoenix bird that is resurrected every 500 years in the Bible. And how on earth is that relevant to the 5 months of torture by these demons?) Have your critical thinking skills kicked in yet?) But anyway you have the Phoenix bird, that is cast into the fire, think about the fire, (Yes, please. Think.) now in Revelation chapter 9 we have the releasing of the antichrist out of the pit. (No, the king of the bottomless pit is not the antichrist. Antichrist comes on the scene long before the fifth trumpet sounds. How else could all those people come out of the great tribulation after the sixth seal otherwise? He comes on the scene 3 1/2 years before the great tribulation. He isn't released well after the fact.) 

It's interesting to note when we look in Revelation chapter 8 verses 7-10 we have a lot of things that are on fire. (Well since the Lord told us He was going to purge the earth by fire this time, is that really surprising?) That results in the angel coming down, releasing those that are in the bottomless pit. (The release of these demons is not because of the fire. They are released simply because they are the next judgment.) You have Revelation chapter 8 verse 7-10 'The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;' 

You have all of this fire and burning going on and then you have the releasing, the releasing. You have all of this fire and burning going on. (repetition) And then you have the releasing of the angel of the bottomless pit. Revelation 9:11. That's who the Phoenix is (again, what is this mixing of myth and the Bible?), and he builds his nest in the thorns. (What? the angel of the bottomless pit builds his nest in the thorns? ) Think about your life, okay. (Think again. And now somehow you are in the middle of this?) In the Bible the word acacia is not found in the Scriptures. It is however the word Shittim or Shitta. That was the word, that's like from an old Hebrew word, that was the word describing the trees and the thorns of the trees and here is something that is. (That is? That is what? He's rambling again.) Remember what I said, you've got all this stuff, we've already got the thorns in us, right? Okay we've already got the cares of this world, and the lust of other things, and the deceitful........we've already got that in us. 

Here's the interesting thing. God's so wise in what He does. Primarily when you find the word Shittim or Shitta tree in the Scriptures, of course it's the thorn tree. Practically every thing in the tabernacle in the wilderness, remember what the tabernacle is, it's this body right here, (Now again he is making you accept the words "tabernacle" and "temple" as being our body, not the real article.) practically every thing in the tabernacle that had wood in it, it was acacia wood or shittim wood. Thorns. This earthly house, this tabernacle right here (our body is the tabernacle again) is full of thorns and remember the tabernacle itself had twenty boards down one side and twenty boards down the other and six boards across the back. Forty-six, the number of chromosomes. (Again with the chromosomes. He neglects to inform you that there were also two additional boards for each corner adding eight boards to his sum of 46 making the total 54. Not the number of our chromosomes.) We've already got it in us. And this tabernacle needs to be dissolved. (Again with the threats?  Yes, we know we will all die because sin causes death, but what about repentance?  Is that never going to be mentioned?)

The interesting thing, I like this now, here's where we're gonna get good and we're almost done, the crown of thorns, the acacia, the word Shittim or shitta in the King James Bible, it's mentioned exactly 33 times. 33 times in the King James Bible this word is used to describe the tree that bears the thorns,(That is blatantly not true. It is mentioned 28 times as the tree. Five times it is the name of a city.) think of the One, the tree, who was the tree of life (Christ is never referred to as the Tree of Life.  He is the Bread of Life. The tree of life is a literal tree. This calling Christ the tree of life is taken from Christian Identity teachings. They teach that Jesus is the Tree of Life, and Satan is the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.) and yet He had done nothing wrong and He had never disobeyed God one time and yet he took upon himself the curse that's what that, that's what that crown of thorns represented on, That's what that crown of thorns represented on Jesus Christ. (repetition) Number 1, it denotes a king. (Wait, what? A crown of thorns denotes a king? Since when? I thought he just said it denoted a curse. None of the associations with thorns that he laid down had to do with kingship, and especially not a righteous king. Where is he pulling that out of? A hat?) We saw who that king was. (Talk about confusing. First he says that what the crown represents on Christ is a curse, then kingship, and now it's the king of the bottomless pit? What, a crown of thorns? I'm confused.) Revelation 9:11, it's the king of the bottomless pit, the Phoenix that's going to rise again one of these days (again with the mythology?). The thorns, it represents the curse and it represents the specific curse that reigns over every man. It is the curse of death. (I thought he just said it denotes a king, now it's a curse again?) The Bible says for it is appointed unto man once to die. We all are going to see death and the Bible says Christ tasted death for every man, but He took, because mankind is sinful, because we are appointed to death, God had a way of redeeming mankind. It was through the man Jesus Christ, who took upon himself the crown of thorns. (No disagreement that Christ took our sins upon Himself.  Was the crown of thorns a representation of that, or simply a tool of torture?)

Think about this (How many times does this make for telling you to think?), the Bible talks about Samson. (How on earth did we get to Samson?) Those that ruled over him were the five lords of the Philistines. There's that number 5 again. (So what? What relevance does this have to a crown of thorns?) That number for death (Says who?) and here we have the five lords of the Philistines who are not just reigning over Samson, they're like literally over him because they're sitting up on the top of the temple of Dagon, and here is Samson underneath and he says, 'let me die with the Philistines.' He brings them down. The Bible says he killed more of his enemies in his death than he did in his life. (And exactly what does this have to do with anything that has been discussed so far?) I love the language in the Scirptures and the symbolism (Oh yes, he loves that symbolism.) of the Scriptures of the King James Bible. Because here is Jesus who took upon himself the crown, the scourge in his side, the thorns in his eyes literally, that crown of thorns he took that upon himself, and he took the king, the one who had power over death upon himself and killed his enemies in his death. Here's something else that goes along with this. The Bible says this phrase, 'the beast', the beast in the New Testament of the King James Bible is mentioned exactly 33 times. (This is not exactly true. One will find the exact phrase "the beast" 33 times in the KJV. However it is not as Hoggard represents it. The first time it is used, it is used to refer to a snake that bit Paul on the hand. The other 32 times, it is found in Revelation and it does refer to the beast known as the antichrist. But then if one looks a little more closely one finds that the word "beast" (without the "the") as referring to the antichrist is mentioned 37 times in Revelation and each time it refers to the antichrist. So the number of the beast is not 33 as Hoggard is saying to make his numeric point. He is deliberately manipulating data for his own purposes. And in fact, he leaves out the times that the antichrist is called the beast in the Old Testament. Would not that also be important? Should we not add those number of times mentioned to the sum? The beast is mentioned in Daniel 6 times. Add that to the 37 and you get 43 times. So that shatters his numerology.)

"And I mentioned earlier a movie, a movie about the birth and the coming of the antichrist. It was actually made in the early 70s and the remake came out this century. It's called the Omen. And it features the birth and the growing of the antichrist, the man of sin, the son of perdition, the king of the bottomless pit (No, No, and again, No. The king of the bottomless pit is a different fallen angel. He does not understand Revelation at all.) whose father was the devil himself. His name was Damien. His last name was Thorn. Jesus defeated the power of the beast, the power of the antichirst, the power of sin and the curse of the thorns, which is the sting of death. Jesus defeated every one of those by taking them onto himself and His sacrificial death for us, he tasted death for every man so that you and I might live." He then goes to Colossians 2:13-15. [And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.] and reads it pointing out we are already dead in sins. That death reigns over us. "Remember the sting of death is sin and the strenghth of sin is the law. It is against us because all of us have broken the law." His last point is that when Jesus died on the cross, death died with Him. He tells us "You were born a sinner. The thorns are dwelling in you, literally in your DNA. You have evil things in your heart that you cannot make go away." Then he says that whosoever believe on the Lord shall be saved. At least finally he gives an answer for all our sins that we cannot make go away.

So he has rambled through all of this information, wandering into all kinds of different areas, implanting new definitions and associations in your mind, harping on DNA and ending with what point? The point that we are sinners who need Christ, because sin is in our DNA. I understand that sermons should end with an altar call when they go out into the world as this does, but this whole journey was the most bizarre of wanderings. Like Hoggard says, think about what you have learned here. Did you see all of the tactics of brainwashing show up in this sermon?  If you did not, you must have been asleep.

In relation to something I mentioned above that I said I would explain, Hoggard teaches that when it says in Thessalonians that the antichrist will sit in the temple declaring himself God, he says that the temple is our heart.  First of all, in Matthew 24 when Christ refers to the abomination of desolation, which this act is, he tells the reader to understand the reference by going to the book of Daniel.  In Daniel we find that the abomination of desolation spoken of is the historical act of Antiochus Epiphanes when he slaughtered a pig on the altar of the temple and set up a statue of Zeus.  This is the event with which we are to associate antichrist's abomination.  To Daniel and all Old Testament people, the temple would refer to nothing but the actual temple. The idea of the temple being our body was not something of which they had any knowledge, so Daniel most certainly would not be referencing the temple in that way.  Second, logically it does not make sense.  Our bodies only become the temple of God when it is indwelt by the Holy Spirit.  Bodies that do not have that indwelling, are not the temple of God.  Now, taking that into consideration, if the verse says that antichrist will sit in the temple, and the temple is only referring to Christians, not unbelievers, then does that not make the verse then say that antichrist will delude all Christians and reign in their hearts, as opposed to reigning in the hearts of unbelievers?  Then would not all Christians be lost?  It is completely illogical to interpret that verse in this way, so Hoggard's whole idea of turning every organ in our body into a representative of a piece of the temple, so that he can make this verse mean our body is silly at best.  Logic does not seem to be his friend.


  1. Hi Connie, this was an interesting article. Clearly you disagree with Mikes teachings. I have seen a few of Mikes videos and what I've understood from them is the following. In the not so distant future scientists will be able to manipulate human DNA in order to improve and change mankind. The goal of this is really to discover the secret of immortality in a body of flesh.

    Mike mentioned that our DNA is like a book, the words that God spoke. The word of God should not be altered and the temple which Paul says in 1 Corinthians 6:19 is our bodies should not be polluted with an idol. Mike is teaching that we should not accept anything which would manipulate our genetic makeup or that of our children's and that the bible is warning us about this.

    Revelation 22:18
    For I testify unto every man that hearth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    Mike gives away his video's and even his books are freely downloadable from his church website. He doesn't make loads of money from his teachings as everything is free. I'm wondering what you think his agenda is?

  2. Hi MC,

    Thank you for your comments. I don't necessarily think that Mike has a conscious agenda. What I do think is that any time a pastor becomes "famous" and has a big following and multiple media broadcasts, he is a target for Satan to corrupt his teachings. Most of these kind of people start out very sincere and right on, in fact I am totally on board with his preaching against all this New Age stuff that has infiltrated the church, and I have said so in my articles on him. The problem seems to be, as is true with anyone who finds themselves with a large audience, pride starts to creep in.

    I have noticed from some things he has done and said in reaction to several people, that when they try to speak to him about something they think he has gotten off track on, he becomes very curt and even nasty at times with them, insisting he is right. That is when Satan gets in there and starts corrupting the teachings, when one will not even listen to others. Slowly and subtly at first so nobody picks up on it, but then gradually as people keep accepting things, they stray farther and farther from truth. They feel they are getting special revelations from God, and if you listen much to Mike you know that he does talk about revelations all the time.

    Mike has said things that are blatantly unscriptural and he needs to be called on it and brought back, but he isn't accepting correction from people (I am talking other's experiences, not mine. I have not tried to contact him on this stuff).

    I am well aware that the government and science is seeking to make us transhumans, they have already started long ago by altering our food, so it is already too late. It has been genetically altered to change some of our bodies' functions (have you noticed girls are entering puberty at a much lower age and the upper bodies they are sporting? My generation did not look like that). They inject our food with hormones that are causing these changes. It has also been altered to be less nutritious so that people will get fat while they starve to death. I do not disagree with these facts, however I do disagree that this is the mark of the beast. If it is, we are already lost. Plus, it is not a scriptural teaching that it is the mark of the beast. He takes things too far, which is his problem.

    I do not think that the whole issue of the nephilim is the gospel message. I heard him actually say this. I believe nephilim still exist also and are a threat, but he is taking these facts and going places with them he should not go changing the meaning of Scripture in many cases, such as the one I just mentioned. He interprets Scripture through the lens of Morals and Dogma and the other Masonic books rather than the other way around. Have you read my other two articles on him? He is straying from truth and taking people with him. This is what I am against. It has nothing to do with him personally. I agree with what you wrote in Rev. 22:18, which is precisely the reason that I have written about him. He is adding and taking away from God's Word through his spiritualized and numerological interpretations of things. This is something people need to guard against.

    And as mentioned above, whether he realizes it or not, or if he's just a pawn of Satan, he is using a brainwashing technique to lead people to understand Scripture in a totally new way. A wrong way. People need to be made aware of it so they can listen to him with discernment. He does know and understand what the Masons are up to, and I do not dispute that, but when one listens to repetitions of error (no matter how small) all the time, pretty soon one accepts that error as truth, so one must be on guard when listening to him and sift what he says, as a good Berean, to eliminate the error and just keep what is truth.

  3. Hi Connie, thanks for your reply. I don't think that Mike has changed his teaching style as a result of becoming popular. The number of viewings on his You Tube videos seem quite low and I think his earlier videos have a similar style to newer ones. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm interested in your use of the word nephilim (fallen ones) why do you think they still exist and are a threat? I'd like to understand your statement of faith better, if you have a link to a pastor you recommend then I'd be very interested to take a look.

  4. Hi MC,

    If Mike's teaching is the same as always, then he has had some problems right from the start. One of the things that bothers me that I have heard him tell is his obsession with the occultic cartoons and shows when he was young. Those have influenced his thoughts and I don't know if he has ever rebuked the spirit that would have come to influence his life through these things. He does seem to still be osessed with the occult and all its teachings. While it is good to understand this to a point, he spends way too much time upon it in my opinion, when he should be teaching his congregations and listeners the Bible. The number of viewings on Youtube may not be all that high, because I think everyone goes to his websites to listen to him. He has multiple ones. His own plus the church's.

    I can't prove the nephilim still exist, but the evidence is there that seriously suggests it. You can read my article on this here If the link doesn't work, just look over to the right under most popular posts where I address giants and nephilim. First I explain why Genesis 6 is truly talking about an angelic/human hybrid and not the descendents of Seth when it talks about the giants and men of renown.

    I really do not like to recommend anyone, for I can't stay on top of everyone to see what they are preaching all the time. I personally do not spend a lot of time listening to lots of preachers, because I spend what time I have deeply in Bible study myself, but there is one prophecy author whom I trust implicitly to give accurate information. His books are really on the New World Order and New World religion rather than Bible study, but they are valuable resources for information about what is going on in the world, which every Christian should be made aware of. His name is Gary Kah. You can google his name and find his website.

    If you have only visited this website, I also have one that is an endtimes study. It actually begins in Genesis and goes through Revelation and then goes back into the O.T. prophets to study Babylon and antichrist, plus a few random posts. It's found at That will help you understand some of my beliefs.

    As for my statement of faith, much of it can be discerned from my articles such as Arminianism vs. Calvinism, baptism, the Lord Supper article, etc. Briefly, I believe in the Triune God - the Father, Son, Holy Spirit. I believe faith in Christ is the only means of salvation. I believe the Scriptures are the infallible word of God to be taken literally. I believe the most accurate translation of the Bible is the KJV (see my article here on that too, for why.) I believe Christ is coming again soon, that there will be a seven year period known as Daniel's 70th week, in a last trumpet rapture of the church, and a thousand year reign of Christ. Basically I believe in the Bible literally - from Genesis and a 24 hour seven day creation to the end. If you want specific answers, you are more than welcome to ask any question of me and I will be happy to answer. A lot can be found out through my articles, as I said above. Check through my archives for titles. Hope that helps.

  5. Hi Connie,
    I read your post about the nephilim and I agree that the correct interpretation of Genesis 6:4 is that the sons of God were angels. You do, however go on to mention many other things that aren't in the Bible. I also noticed that you're writing Yeshua instead of Jesus which (along with nephilim) aren't words that we find in the King James Bible. Do you have a reason for this preference? Thank you for your information on Gary Kah. I did notice that he appeared on It's Supernatural with Sid Roth which after seeing the trailer looks like a program I would be a little suspicious of:
    Thank you for your faith statement. Have you asked the LORD Jesus Christ into your heart and life as your personal saviour?
    I think it would be interesting to collect some Bible verses that illustrate the concerns you describe above. Would you like to help with this? This is the first:
    Genesis 2:16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: 17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

  6. MC,

    I accepted the Lord when I was four years old, and because I thought my posts reflected that (I forgot that that information is found more in my endtimes blog, not over here on my second one, I didn't think about emphasizing that as it seems such a given if you read very many of my posts. It is has always been such a part of my being that I don't think about having to explain it to people, as anyone who knows me pretty much understands it. I forget sometimes that people coming here don't know me and that I need to mention the fact. I guess I always thought my writing spoke for itself. Maybe I should add something to my description.

    As for the Nephilim, I thought that I had made the distinction between what was Scripture and what was simply some evidence that shows that possibly there is a very good case to be made for them to still be around. I try to always make that distinction in my writing to draw that line and to tell people that, when I speculate, so they do not make the mistake of thinking that my suppositions drawn from other information is the same as what the Scriptures say. I will double check what I wrote, as I thought I made it clear which was Scriptural and what was just looking at the rest of history and such to draw some conclusions that we cannot necessarily prove to be true. It is true according to Scripture that Israel did not kill all the inhabitants of the land. It is also true that there are historical records from the early explorers of the Americas that they did see giants, very tall giants who fit the description of nephilim. That is simply a historical fact. And the Native North American Indians all tell of the giant races that used to terrorize them in America and were so big they could wrestle buffalo to the ground. Historical records are a good source of fairly reliable information too. The Bible is true in everything, but not everything is in the Bible and sometimes historical records help to flesh out the information.

    Nephilim is a plural use of nephil, which is simply the Hebrew word translated in English as "giants". It is a common word in use (as it is really the original word) to describe these hybrids, as some people object to the word "giants". As far as Yeshua goes, that was His Hebrew name and I see no reason why I should not use His correct name interchangeably along with the Greek translation, as that was His given Hebrew name and what His parents called Him. The KJV is in English, but Jesus did not speak English, nor was the Bible originally written in it, so I will often refer to the Greek or Hebrew word instead, when I am doing a study. I see no problem with this, do you?

    I would have to watch the program you mentioned before I could make any comment on it. Gary will sometimes accept offers to talk on shows that he wouldn't listen to himself, just to get the information he has out. He feels it is that important for people to know and Satan has opposed him from the very beginning when he began exposing this. I know Gary personally and can vouch for both his character and Christian walk with the Lord. He has been through a great deal to bring this information to people, including being on an FBI hit list for a while, because he was a threat to the New World Order when he first started exposing them. His family has sacrificed a lot for him to do this, as they are so committed to the Lord.

    I'm not sure which concerns you are referring to (there is a lot above) that you think verses should be collected for. I'm not sure what you are linking Genesis 2:16 to in what I wrote above. Could you clarify what exactly you want verses to illustrate? There is a lot of information above between the post and comments.

  7. Hi Connie,

    I think the decision whether you want to use Yeshua or Jesus is between you and the LORD. Please correct me if I'm wrong but when you asked the LORD to save you at the age of 4 didn't you ask in Jesus name? And he did answer you! Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

  8. I am having trouble understanding why you are so disturbed by the fact that I occasionally call Jesus by His actual given name of Yeshua. On some posts I say Jesus, and on some I use Yeshua. On some I say Christ and on some I say haMashiach. On some I go back and forth between the two interchangeably. It depends on how I feel led at the moment.

    Since some of my readers are Messianic and prefer Yeshua and since that is actually His real given name, not the Greek translation of "Jesus", I am not comprehending why you seem to find that so unsettling that you felt the need to qualify it by saying it is between me and the Lord, as if there is something not quite right with my doing it. Why does it bother you so? Is there some Scriptural reason you feel this way, or does it just bother you because it is a Jewish name? After all He was Jewish.

    Yes, I did ask "Jesus" into my heart, because I knew no other name for Him at the time, and He knows the intent of people's heart no matter what translation of His name they use. My name is Connie, but I have had an Italian friend call me Concetta. I don't mind, as it is pretty, but it really isn't my name. It is her translation of my name in her language. Don't you supposed Yeshua enjoys being called by His given name on occasion? How would you feel if everyone was calling you by your name in a different language all the time rather than your name as it was actually given to you? I imagine, like me, you wouldn't mind, but wouldn't you like to occasionally be called by your actual name? I imagine He does too. Don't you?

  9. Some people think that if we don't pronounce Jesus' name properly (either as Yeshua or Iēsoûs) then we are in sin and serving a false pagan god. Some people think and will tell you that the name Jesus is derived from Zeus and really means hail Zeus. This is a false teaching and is just plain wrong.

  10. Hi MC

    Oh, now I see why you were concerned. Yes some people are..well, shall we say, missing the entire point completely? That is so legalistic for lack of a better word. I can't tell you how many people I talk to who are off into things that are so unscriptural and have nothing to do with a relationship with God through Jesus Christ, that it is mind boggling. That is why I write so much. I get annoyed at people going way beyond what Scripture says. And yes, I realize that I do speculate in some of my posts based on history, archeology, reports, etc., but I try to be careful to make sure it is completely understood that it is speculation and not Bible truth. If you see somewhere where I haven't done this (probably due to being tired. I tend to write for hours on end when I do write), please let me know so I can correct that.

    Right now I have to investigate (and most likely debunk) another "new" teaching of which I've just been informed by a friend. It never ends. Lots of people, (and that is where Mike Hoggard comes in here) teach things as if they are bona fide truth straight from the Bible when they aren't. For instance, have you read my article on his Bible codes? It is Harold Campingism all over again. I would like to excuse him on this as being very careless in his research, but there are so many errors that I have trouble not thinking he is very aware of his manipulations.

    I am so glad that you pursued this by questioning me until you got an answer. (At least I think you got an answer.)Hopefully it was one that was agreeable to you. I wish that more people were Bereans like that. Feel free to question me on anything you want. I believe in being able to defend what I believe and teach. That is what God tells us to do and so few are able to.

    God bless.

  11. Connie, You are certainly obsessed with Mike Hoggard. Could it be because he has spoken out against eschatology (end of times) teachers such as yourself. Mike Hoggard also states the truth about the Vatican. I read on your endtimesstudies.blogspot that you dismiss the theory that the Vatican is Babylon or the Harlot in Rev 17 ...clearly it is. That is the standard by which I judge all you religious teachers ...what is your stance on the Roman Catholic Church? I also see a lot of Bible interpretation on your site too! Mike's videos have connected a lot of dots for me. He is extremely knowledgeable and I find him reputable. I'm going with Mike. Hmmm, you go on and on about him. Looks like you have an axe to grind. Enough already.

  12. Pam,

    I wrote three articles on Mike. In my first one, I gave him his due and credit for the stand he takes against the many types of the apostasy in the church. He and I are in agreement on many of those things. You fail to mention that, only my "axe to grind." My problem is with some of the doctrines that Mike teaches and his manner of interpreting the Bible (revelation rather than study, spiritualize rather than take God at His Word literally). I don't consider that writing three articles, one on his doctrines in general, one on his method of teaching, and one on his use of the occult practice of numerology, is obsessing beyond what is necessary, as it took these three articles to show what he is doing, of which people should be very wary. If you have read all three of my articles and still find nothing wrong with what he is doing and want to continue to follow him, that is certainly your choice. I certainly don't want to. My "axe to grind" as you put it, is not with him personally, but with the way and what he teaches using the occult (he spends an awful lot of time studying and teaching the occult-the Masonic books) and occult methods (using numerology). Also unlike Mike, who spiritualizes and gets his theological ideas from "revelation", I study what is written taking God's Word literally, which does not really leave much room for personal interpretation, and compare Scripture to Scripture to understand, rather then looking for ideas to pop into my head via "special revelation" or use numerology to see connections which don't really exist.

    If you judge the validity of everybody's teachings on whether or not they believe the Vatican is the Whore, then you will certainly miss out on a lot of truth and accept a lot of error. But again, that is your choice. Nobody has to accept what I say. Everybody should be a Berean and check these things for themselves. Harold Camping was extremely reputable too, and I also took a stand against his teachings (he also spiritualized Scripture and used numerology as his "decoding devise"). Look at what happened to his followers.

    As for "enough already", I quit writing about Mike some time ago. I wrote three articles and stopped concerning myself with him anymore. I am not still grinding an axe, as you put it. I think I wrote plenty for anyone who has an ear to hear to understand the problem. If you don't see the problem, well, that's your decision.

  13. Connie, you said: If you judge the validity of everybody's teachings on whether or not they believe the Vatican is the Whore, then you will certainly miss out on a lot of truth and accept a lot of error.

    If the Vatican is not the whore of Rev 17 then explain these references...
    She was arrayed in purple and scarlet ...just like the cardinals and bishops at the vatican.
    She was adorned with gold and precious stones ...go look at the loot at the vatican. (...and why do the priests "bow down" to the golden sun god monstrance? ...wearing their pagan god Dagon fish hat mitre?)
    In her hand was a golden cup of abominations ...transubstantiation became doctrine after the Reformation to keep the masses coming to church with their donations. (Not to mention charging the people for indulgences for forgiveness of sins ...and modern day Mass cards to buy your loved ones passage out of non-existent Purgatory.)
    She was drunk with the blood of the saints ...Inqusition: millions of Christians tortured and killed for reading the Bible. Millions of translated Bibles burned.
    Where am I wrong?
    Where I live is a convent with Mary on the facade being "assumed" into heaven, just like Jesus. It reads, without original sin. Why have the RCC made Mary a god? It sits on Bellona Rd ...another name for Isis. Queen of Heaven! Jer 7:18

  14. Pam,
    You are very limited in your thinking of Babylon. She is so much bigger than the RC church. Yes, in the course of history she did headquarters herself there for a while, and left her corruption behind, just as she has infiltrated the Protestant church and incorporated her filth there too. You mention the colors and the jewels, but you conveniently leave out the other things listed in Revelation, things that do not necessarily apply to the Vatican. Not to mention we are told to come out of her. Most true Christians are not found in the RC church. To try to even begin to explain this to you, when you are still clinging to the old concept of who she is would be impossible in a short post. I am guessing that if you believe RC is the Whore, you are probably pre-trib too? The two seem to go hand in hand. If you prefer to think the RC church and the Vatican is the city that rules the world that is your choice and privilege. It is not my job to make people believe the truth, just to present it.

    The truth is, almost if not all of the world's political leaders, as well as a great many religious leaders both in the Vatican and Protestant churches, as well as other religions are Masons. That is the true religion of the Whore. It is on every continent, in every country, and controls most every world and many religious leaders. They worship her through Masonry. Her headquarters (the Supreme Mother Council of the World Masonic headquarters) and temple (the nation's capitol building) is located in Washington, DC. America is the one who fornicates with the rest of the world, and if you wait probably just a few more years I am sure America will hand you more Christian martyrs than you can count. Their blood will run in the streets, although the blood of the saints comes from her entire history, not just from her sojourn in the RC church and the future in America, but her entire history.

    America sits as a queen saying, "Nobody can touch me". The seven hills business is bogus. First that isn't what the mountains stand for in Revelation, they stand for nations or kingdoms by Biblical precedent, and the kings who ran them (which is what Rev. says) and second the Vatican is not sitting on the Seven Hills of Rome. Get out a map and look.

    Third, the merchants of the world are not going to wail and weep if the Vatican was bombed, nor would Catholicism cease to exist if it were destroyed. The world is more interested in buying and selling from America. We are the mass consumer that lives in luxury (which is what these products listed are - luxury items.) RC would not cease to exist without the Vatican. It is bigger than that. They would simply set up elsewhere and elect a new pope. However if America were destroyed and the world would suffer, for we do buy and sell every kind of product in the world. Without us, who would buy all that stuff. The voice of harpers, musicians, pipers, trumpeters, craftsmen, brides, and bridegrooms are not heard in the Vatican, but they are heard in America. We have a statue to her both in NYC harbor, and on top of the nation's capitol building, which happens to be her temple. America was founded by Masons and Illuminists, and it is now run by the same, her people. The RC church is merely one of her many tentacles, and yes Mary is her representative in that arena, but it is not her headquarters. You need to have a much broader view of her.

  15. C- You need to have a deeper view of what is really going on. Its not the masons ...its Satan. The Vatican sits where the occultist pagan church of Janus once was. The Jesuits share headquarters with the Knights of Malta and the Jesuits secretly own Freemasonry. Adam Weishaupt who started the Illuminati was a Jesuit. Why does the Vatican have an obelisk and dome just like DC? DC was gifted to us by the Vatican via the RC Carroll family. It was originally called little Rome. Google it. Our government is secretly governed by Georgetown Jesuit Univ. Google the Red Mass. The District of "Columbia" (same as Isis etc) borders Mary-land and Virgin-ia. I live in the area and am an ex-RC. The symbolism on our buildings makes your head spin. I've been studying this for years. America may have killed many in war but not millions of Christians for owning Bibles! Why does the RCC hate that book? Vatican II is behind the eccumenical movement, destroying Christianity. The counter-Reformation is alive and well ...and so is Satan. The NWO is not for money; its for mens souls.

  16. Pam,
    You are certainly entitled to your opinion.

    1. C- and you yours. That is what is so beautiful about America. Freedom of thought and speech ...well currently anyway. Look at the oppression and poverty of the Catholic-majority countries. God bless us all!
      Hunkering down for the storm ...the one off the coast that is! Enjoyed the debate.

  17. I can't even listen to Mike Hoggard. Nothing he says makes sense. He just runs around in circles. Reading his sermon word-for-word made my head hurt. It would take someone being brainwashed to be able to sit and listen to that drivel. Why don't people stop wasting their time listening to him and trying to prove him wrong, delving into dark things and actually live in the light, keep their mind stayed on Christ instead of decoding some end times scandal and seek to further God's Kingdom not their own?

    1. Personally I do not spend time listening to these people at all unless someone among my friends or family gets hooked on listening to these teachers, and I start hearing them parrot teachings that are not Scriptural. Then I have to force myself to listen to enough in order to be able to expose their false teachings, to try to show people the error. That is why I wrote on Harold Camping and why I have written on Mike.

      I think people listen to these guys because 1) people are too lazy to study for themselves and 2) most of them teach that they have special revelation and people want to feel they are also special by extension of being in this person's camp. People love to think they have been let in on secrets that nobody else knows.

  18. The books, such as Morals and Dogma and all those other books that represent dark secrets and Satanic; are on Mike Hoggard's desk most of the time. It puzzled me, as to why they are picked up often; but he doesn't really use them for anything. They are sitting there is all. Why is this even necessary, and what do they have to do with the Word of God?
    The other aspect that concerned me, was his often reference of EVIL and dark movies. And he seems to know all about them, details even. NO pastor or preacher of the gospel, should be looking at these devilish things. We shouldn't either. Consequently, there's a lot of darkness in his teachings. I stopped watching, Watchmen's Broadcast; for these reasons. There's just too much darkness presented.

    1. Mike seems to spend more time in those books than the Bible. In fact he interprets the Bible through them. He has often told how as a young person he was deeply into all these occultic shows on TV and etc. He still really is, I think. He just loves the dark side. It's one thing to not be ignorant of this stuff, it's another to immerse yourself in it to the extent he does.

  19. Very true. We do need to be informed, and not ignorant without being immersed in the darkness. We can't sit at the devil's table and the Lord's at the same time. On our website we expose the deception out there; but we'll only go so far. If something is over the top with darkness, forget it. It just might cause someone to stumble. Thanks, for listening.